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	<title>Comments on: The Burning Issue of 2012</title>
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	<link>http://www.coyoteblog.com/coyote_blog/2007/04/the_burning_iss.html</link>
	<description>Dispatches from a Small Business</description>
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		<title>By: bbartlog</title>
		<link>http://www.coyoteblog.com/coyote_blog/2007/04/the_burning_iss.html/comment-page-1#comment-5221</link>
		<dc:creator>bbartlog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Apr 2007 13:23:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://coyote-blog.com/wordpress/2007/04/the_burning_iss.html#comment-5221</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Maybe peak oil will *save* us from the pension problem by triggering some sort of hyperinflation, thereby rendering the pension obligations manageable :-P.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;/p&gt;

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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Maybe peak oil will *save* us from the pension problem by triggering some sort of hyperinflation, thereby rendering the pension obligations manageable <img src='http://www.coyoteblog.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_razz.gif' alt=':-P' class='wp-smiley' /> .</p>
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		<title>By: Dan</title>
		<link>http://www.coyoteblog.com/coyote_blog/2007/04/the_burning_iss.html/comment-page-1#comment-5220</link>
		<dc:creator>Dan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Apr 2007 15:02:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://coyote-blog.com/wordpress/2007/04/the_burning_iss.html#comment-5220</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Let&#039;s hope you&#039;re right and that this is the big issue dominating in 2012, for that will mean that peak oil hasn&#039;t really hit yet, as I suspect it will before then.&lt;/p&gt;

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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Let&#8217;s hope you&#8217;re right and that this is the big issue dominating in 2012, for that will mean that peak oil hasn&#8217;t really hit yet, as I suspect it will before then.</p>
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		<title>By: Dan</title>
		<link>http://www.coyoteblog.com/coyote_blog/2007/04/the_burning_iss.html/comment-page-1#comment-5219</link>
		<dc:creator>Dan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Apr 2007 15:02:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://coyote-blog.com/wordpress/2007/04/the_burning_iss.html#comment-5219</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Let&#039;s hope you&#039;re right and that this is the big issue dominating in 2012, for that will mean that peak oil hasn&#039;t really hit yet, as I suspect it will before then.&lt;/p&gt;

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Let&#8217;s hope you&#8217;re right and that this is the big issue dominating in 2012, for that will mean that peak oil hasn&#8217;t really hit yet, as I suspect it will before then.</p>
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		<title>By: markm</title>
		<link>http://www.coyoteblog.com/coyote_blog/2007/04/the_burning_iss.html/comment-page-1#comment-5218</link>
		<dc:creator>markm</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Apr 2007 13:52:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://coyote-blog.com/wordpress/2007/04/the_burning_iss.html#comment-5218</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;mjh: (1) The government is still being dishonest when it hides a future huge hit on the budget.&lt;br /&gt;
(2) It&#039;s not always possible to raise more money by more taxation. Past a certain (generally unknown) point, higher tax rates will result in lower tax collections as the economy tanks.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Governments have defaulted on their obligations. The State of Michigan did, about 1961. One result of that was a new state constitution, that requires the budget be balanced each year - but I don&#039;t know if that requires setting money aside for future pension obligations or not. It&#039;s even happened on a national scale, and even to first-world countries. In the 1920&#039;s, France got into a position where the interest on the national debt exceeded the maximum that could be collected in taxes. (And squeezing the Germans for &quot;war reparations&quot; owed from WWI accomplished nothing except destroying the German economy too, getting Hitler elected, and causing WWII.) Much of this debt was in what Americans would call &quot;savings bonds&quot;, owed by the government to individual Frenchmen. After some years of digging themselves deeper in the hole by borrowing to cover interest payments, the French government issued new francs, at a 10:1 ratio with old francs, and in the process devalued their debts by 90%. That destroyed many individual retirement plans which had been based on those bonds.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;AFAIK, that huge default was the last time French politicians united to act courageously or responsibly, and the ones responsible were never elected to anything again.&lt;/p&gt;

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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>mjh: (1) The government is still being dishonest when it hides a future huge hit on the budget.<br />
(2) It&#8217;s not always possible to raise more money by more taxation. Past a certain (generally unknown) point, higher tax rates will result in lower tax collections as the economy tanks.</p>
<p>Governments have defaulted on their obligations. The State of Michigan did, about 1961. One result of that was a new state constitution, that requires the budget be balanced each year &#8211; but I don&#8217;t know if that requires setting money aside for future pension obligations or not. It&#8217;s even happened on a national scale, and even to first-world countries. In the 1920&#8242;s, France got into a position where the interest on the national debt exceeded the maximum that could be collected in taxes. (And squeezing the Germans for &#8220;war reparations&#8221; owed from WWI accomplished nothing except destroying the German economy too, getting Hitler elected, and causing WWII.) Much of this debt was in what Americans would call &#8220;savings bonds&#8221;, owed by the government to individual Frenchmen. After some years of digging themselves deeper in the hole by borrowing to cover interest payments, the French government issued new francs, at a 10:1 ratio with old francs, and in the process devalued their debts by 90%. That destroyed many individual retirement plans which had been based on those bonds.</p>
<p>AFAIK, that huge default was the last time French politicians united to act courageously or responsibly, and the ones responsible were never elected to anything again.</p>
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		<title>By: dearieme</title>
		<link>http://www.coyoteblog.com/coyote_blog/2007/04/the_burning_iss.html/comment-page-1#comment-5217</link>
		<dc:creator>dearieme</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 05 Apr 2007 22:44:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://coyote-blog.com/wordpress/2007/04/the_burning_iss.html#comment-5217</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;FDR reneged on Federal obligations: abroad it was called The American Default.&lt;/p&gt;

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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>FDR reneged on Federal obligations: abroad it was called The American Default.</p>
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		<title>By: mjh</title>
		<link>http://www.coyoteblog.com/coyote_blog/2007/04/the_burning_iss.html/comment-page-1#comment-5216</link>
		<dc:creator>mjh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 05 Apr 2007 20:43:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://coyote-blog.com/wordpress/2007/04/the_burning_iss.html#comment-5216</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Isn&#039;t there a big difference between an unfunded liability that a private corporation incurs and one that a government incurs?  Namely that the government doesn&#039;t cease to exist and can (even if it&#039;s ridiculously expensive to do so) fulfill its unfunded obligation either through debt or increased taxes, whereas a private company can go out of business and never fulfill its obligation.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Doesn&#039;t that difference have a marked effect on how people view the risks associated with unfunded government liabilities vs private ones?&lt;/p&gt;

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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Isn&#8217;t there a big difference between an unfunded liability that a private corporation incurs and one that a government incurs?  Namely that the government doesn&#8217;t cease to exist and can (even if it&#8217;s ridiculously expensive to do so) fulfill its unfunded obligation either through debt or increased taxes, whereas a private company can go out of business and never fulfill its obligation.</p>
<p>Doesn&#8217;t that difference have a marked effect on how people view the risks associated with unfunded government liabilities vs private ones?</p>
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		<title>By: M. Hodak</title>
		<link>http://www.coyoteblog.com/coyote_blog/2007/04/the_burning_iss.html/comment-page-1#comment-5215</link>
		<dc:creator>M. Hodak</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 05 Apr 2007 19:04:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://coyote-blog.com/wordpress/2007/04/the_burning_iss.html#comment-5215</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;And if the states have chief accounting officers as honest as the U.S. federal government (I&#039;m not being sarcastic this time: see http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2005-11-14-fiscal-hurricane-cover_x.htm), then they too will be declared &quot;broken business models.&quot;&lt;/p&gt;

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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And if the states have chief accounting officers as honest as the U.S. federal government (I&#8217;m not being sarcastic this time: see <a href="http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2005-11-14-fiscal-hurricane-cover_x.htm" rel="nofollow">http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2005-11-14-fiscal-hurricane-cover_x.htm</a>), then they too will be declared &#8220;broken business models.&#8221;</p>
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